Thoughts on TiVo?

[jducoeur]

msmemory and I find ourselves pondering what we're going to do about the whole digital-TV switchover. Not that we're receiving signals over-the-air, mind -- the supposedly-government-subsidized converter boxes aren't relevant to us. No, our problem is that the cable industry is lying through its teeth about the "if you have cable, you don't have a problem" thing.

You see, we are on cable, and we pay a pretty penny for a fairly high-end package. But the reality is that the cables are *also* switching over to digital, for reasons related to those for the over-the-air change -- it's just lower-bandwidth, which lets them cram more channels in. And this means that any TV that is directly plugged into the cable (as opposed to through a cable box) is potentially screwed. Particularly to us, I am fairly sure that our trusty old Panasonic DVR, which has served us so well for many years, only has an analog receiver, so it's probably toast sometime fairly soon.

So we're pondering our options. We clearly want a functioning DVR -- it's how we watch all the TV we actually give a damn about. (Food Network is fine when we're simply looking for background noise, but we watch most of our series on the DVR.) Enough people have raved about TiVo for long enough that we're considering knuckling under and becoming part of the body.

In which case, the next question is *which* TiVo? The temptation is to go for way-high-end, but I'm taking my time and considering it carefully before spending that much money. The logic for it is that it's a good investment. We're clearly going to want HD capability within the next year or two, so it only makes sense to buy one of the HD models. Besides, the HD model accepts two CableCards, which is probably what we're going to want. (Not to mention the ability to download from Netflix, which is *very* appealing.)

And if we're going to do that, it may make the most sense to shell out the extra $250 for the insanely-large hard drive. The ordinary HD model has more than enough space for conventional-definition shows, but only about 20 hours of HD. Given that we routinely have 100 hours of stuff in our backlog on the Panasonic, this seems like it might become a problem if HD becomes common.

Related to this is the question of which plan to get. Again, there's an argument for going whole-hog: the "lifetime of the DVR" plan is pricey -- about $400 -- but that's the equivalent of about three years of service. If we expect to keep the device in service for a long time (and I'd certainly like to), then the lifetime plan might make sense. Moreover, it potentially increases the resale value of the device considerably if we decided to trade up to something else a few years down the line. So the question there is, how reliable have people found TiVos to be? Can we reasonably expect to get the 5+ years of service it'll take for the lifetime plan to be worthwhile?

Opinions welcomed. I don't have any idea what Comcast's timetable is, but I have no faith that the Panasonic will continue to work past mid-February, so this is gradually turning into a pressing question for us, and we'll have to act soon...

Comments

My thoughts

[etherial.livejournal.com]

First, a confession: I had a first model TiVo. I've had 3 over the years, couldn't dream of living without a DVR and ever watching television again. The lifetime membership is totally worth it if they're offering them again. You're right about resale as well. It increases resale value dramatically. The extra money for disk space might be better spent on installing your own HD, but I don't recall how much of a hardware geek you are, so you may find your time and money are better spent on the "official" product. I don't know if you know him, but megazone's GizmoLovers started out as "TiVo Lovers", and he's had good reviews (of both the positive and not so positive variety) on the various options they offer.

[dsrtao]

YMMV, of course, but:

- we have a Series 1 original TiVo. We bought the lifetime plan for it. We upgraded the little disk. (Actually, metahacker did.) And eventually, we bought a TiVo HD, with a special offer to move over the lifetime plan and put a one-year plan on the old TiVo. That one-year plan has now expired, and yet the S1 TiVo continues to work (hardware-wise).

I think that if you buy a TiVo, it will probably last for 5 years or so, barring accidents.

- we also have a MythTV box. It is as easy to use as the TiVo, and more functional, but also requires enough setup and ongoing maintenance that it is not suitable *yet* for people who don't live in a house with a sysadmin.
In five years, that may change. The current software revision is 0.21, after all.

[bkdelong.livejournal.com]

We went with the lifetime plan and it's great for a low-cost Tivo. Like something that could ostensibly be a usable secondary workhorse in the 3rd floor guest room. As ours still is.

I presently have a Dual-Tuner Series 2 and think it is fine for what it does. But then I also have Digital Cable packages and several shows that I watch. I have a script that will unDRM the Tivo files once on my Storage network and they get filed away by show for later re-uploading.

Tivo's "video upload" feature is pretty cool but you need to be sure the network connectivity to the Tivo is wired if you're going to be transfering between 2 tivos, pulling stuff to store or uploading torrented files onto it. It also works with Netflix and Amazon's Unbox which can take hours to download a single TV episode or movie if your Net bandwidth is slow and you don't have a decent cable going to the box.

That's MY experience.

In the next few years I'll probably upgrade to an HDTV, Series 3 HDTivo which will also let me auto-pull videos off YouTube which is always fun.

For now, this seems to work OK. I need to get over to Comcast to return the broken cable box upstairs which doesn't appear to be showing digital content.

[oakleaf-mirror.livejournal.com]

I have a TiVo from the early days of Series 2 — about 5+ years old, I think. Like your Panasonic, I suspect obsolescence will be what eventually does it in. I'm very glad I got lifetime service with it, and if I get another TiVo box, I'd do that again.

One thing you might want to check is getting TiVo service from Comcast. That is, as long as you need a digital cable box from Comcast, they have some that include DVR capabilities with a TiVo branded UI and service. It costs more than the regular box on a montly basis, but less than if you bought TiVo service yourself, I think, as well as no hardware costs. I haven't looked closely at this, yet, because I really hate the thought of giving any additional money to Comcast.

I had to go to a digital cable box about four months ago. Comcast shoved some of the channels I watch to digital only. This was a bit of a pain, because instead of having Tivoli (my TiVo) tune the channels off the cable directly, it had to be configured to control the cable box to switch stations at need. This works okay, except when it doesn't. I've had a few times where I go to watch something I've recorded, only to find that it recorded something from a different channel, because the cable box has stopped listening to Tivoli's channel change requests. The problem seems to be on the cable box side, as the fix is to power cycle the cable box. It's annoying. So, I'd try to avoid having a separate DVR and cable box, if I could. That can be done either by getting a DVR cable box from the company, or one of the new TiVo's that take Cable Cards.

[matildalucet.livejournal.com]

Wait, Comcast is lying to me? We have analog cable and they haven't said anything about forcing us to a digital package. If our signal is going away or if they are going to force us to rent a cable box, there will be screaming and gnashing of teeth here.

[goldsquare.livejournal.com]

I must admit - my first DVR is a little over a year old, and it is the rental box from Dish Network. It is quite price competitive and I'm happy with it - although the UI is a bit stinky.

If you are going to change a little, it might be an opportunity to change a lot...

[laurion]

To be blunt, it may not matter.

RCN recently decided to go all digital. As you said, the logic is similar to the DTV transition, and they're piggybacking on the timeframe to do it. Here's the thing though; the cable companies are not only switching to digital, they're also switching to encrypted channels. As it stands, no DVR can decrypt these signals. I built a DVR with a digital tuner in an attempt to future-proof it. It'll work great with an antenna hooked up, and used to work when RCN had some unencrypted digital channels.

Now I have to have an RCN supplied box anyhow.

Ignoring that argument, I'm a big fan of build over buy, if you're willing to. For about the same cost as that lifetime plan plus the initial costs, you can build a system that will do HAD with plenty of space, and the ability to quickly and cheaply upgrade at any point. Even if you're not interested in mucking around with linux bases systems, you can happily run Windows with Vista MCE, or SageTV. What I would actually recommend is building a system that you can put in your server closet (so to speak) and then use a set top extender (e.g. http://sagetv.com/hd_theater.html). After all, if you're time shifting anyhow, is there a logical reason why the recording device has to be next to the TV?